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Childhood Paranormal Odds And Sods Part 1

 

The following incidents are what initially sparked my fascination in the paranormal and occurred when I was between the ages of four and fifteen. I have broken this account into two parts.

In my latter teens I wrote down what I could remember of these events and these notes have been extremely helpful, as they include details I would otherwise have forgotten. Sadly, I was only able to locate a page and a half of these notes. There were at least three, I believe, but I will do my best to fill in the missing bits. The missing notes only effect the second part.

Just before turning five my family, which comprised my mom and dad, my twin brother, younger sister, two dogs and a cat, moved into what would be our fourth house. We had originally lived in Chicago but this house, like the previous one, is located in the Chicago suburb of Oak Brook. This house is on Concord Drive in a neighborhood called Brook Forest, which is comprised of winding roads and sizable houses on acre lots. The house was built in 1967 and has an architectural style that could be described as Colonial Revival. It looks exactly the same today as when we lived there in the early to mid 1970s and has grey painted wooden panels offset by maroon shutters. The main Colonial section is two stories and adjoining that is a one story wing that comprises a den, enclosed patio and garage.

I have a vivid memory (and this is pertinent to a recurring phenomenon that I will describe shortly) of going to look at the house just prior to my parents finalizing its purchase. This visit was so my brother, sister and I could see the place. The woman who was living there was holding a young child when she met us at the front door and, as it turned out, was selling the house after her husband had died of a sudden heart attack. From what I can remember hearing, he died in the house. This woman's appearance is still etched in my mind. She looked sad and worn out. Recent events in her life seemed almost literally written on her face.

Being kids, we were interested in seeing where the bedrooms were. The second floor contained four bedrooms; the master bedroom, my sister's room, a room that was initially my mom's sewing room (later to be my brother's room) and a bedroom my brother and I initially would share.

Soon after moving in (this would have been in the latter part of 1971 or early 1972) I vividly remember hearing, while lying in bed trying to go to sleep and sometimes in the middle of the night, the voices of a man and a woman arguing. This went on every night for several months. On at least two occasions I got up and walked down the hall to my parents' bedroom only to find them fast asleep. The voices were distinctly angry but always sounded oddly muted and I couldn't make out exactly what was being said. It was like listening to a fight through a thin barrier of water. The sounds of the arguing commonly occurred after everyone else was asleep but there were instances where I could hear my parents downstairs and the arguing voices upstairs. The sound seemed to come from the general direction of the master bedroom.

I was curious about the voices but as I was between four or five when it started and around six when it stopped, I had no reference point and therefore wasn't frightened by them. I found the sounds a bit odd but they just became a part of a typical night for me. Brush my teeth, say goodnight to my mom and dad and then, at some point during the night, hearing the two arguing voices. The voices always started up as if in mid-argument. I could easily distinguish that they were adult voices and were clearly angry. My only speculative theory about the voices is that I was somehow hearing a replay of an argument between the sad looking woman who sold my parents the house and her deceased husband. What intrigues me is that one of the voices I was hearing (if my theory is correct) was of a person still living at the time. This seems like a potentially good example of intense emotions, as expressed by the argument, saturating or impregnating the atmosphere of the master bedroom area of the house. Why I was the only person in the house who seemed able to pick up on this "residual" argument isn't completely clear.

Starting roughly around the same time as the nocturnal voices was a phenomenon that lasted for roughly three years and also occurred every night. Unlike the voices, this phenomenon would also follow me elsewhere. Within a few short minutes of lying down at night, the bed would start lightly rocking as if by an unseen hand trying to coax me to sleep. This would occur whether I was at home or even in another state. It would even happen if someone else was also in the bed. For instance, I have a clear recollection of a family trip to Colorado where my unseen rocker made itself known. It was always a two day drive from Illinois to Colorado and we would stop at a Holiday Inn along the route (it was always a Holiday Inn).

As my brother, sister and I were little kids, my parents would always get a room with two queen sized beds. Usually my dad would hunker down with two of us kids and my mom would sleep with the remaining kid, or vice versa. On the occasion in question, I was sleeping in the bed closest to the door with my mom next to me. As soon as I could tell my mom was asleep, the customary gentle rocking began. I recall glancing over the edge of the bed and could see the comforter swaying in time to the rhythm. My mom was not awoken by the rocking.

Although, like the voices, I did find the nightly rocking strange, without any point of reference I simply accepted it. As far as I can remember it never occurred to me to mention it to my parents. Out of the ordinary it may have seemed but it never frightened me. Both my parents passed away a few years back so I can't question them about it.

One other event at Concord Drive seems possibly related to the nightly bed rocking. One night I had fallen asleep to the rocking, as I always did, and awoke in the middle of the night. Directly across the room from the front of my bed stood a dresser that had a small lamp on it. This light was commonly left on overnight. Upon opening my eyes I was surprised to see a completely black figure that appeared to be a woman reaching under the lampshade. She then turned out the light. This figure was like a cutout of black construction paper. The form definitely had a female outline. I could make out the outline of hair and the arm reaching under the lampshade was thin. This figure did appear to be wearing a close fitting garment that had a sleeve that reached to the wrist. The hand seemed to protrude from this sleeve. I have to emphasize that the figure was pitch black. The lamp light revealed nothing other than this black cutout figure.

Thinking back on it, it almost seems like the figure absorbed the light around it. After it shut out the light I just went back to sleep. Again, although it struck me as something out of the ordinary, the form seemed to radiate a calming, motherly quality. This essence just put me at ease. Shutting the light out struck me as an act of kindness.

I have no way of knowing who or what this figure was but recently I have considered a possibility. My brother and I were adopted when we were just a few months old (my sister was adopted from another woman three years after we were). Just a few years ago my brother and I were able to reconnect with our birth mother. It has been an incredibly great experience getting to know my "bio-mom". We are now quite close. She flies out from her home in Arizona to visit and my wife and I fly out there to see her. Through this relationship I have discovered a family and history I had never known before. My bio-mom revealed that her mother and father both passed away tragically young. I bring this up only because I now wonder if the reassuring figure I saw and the nightly bed rocking were in some way connected to the grandmother I never knew. It might explain why I always felt comforted by the rocking and wasn't alarmed by the motherly figure that shut out the light.

As this is where my paranormal experiences at Concord Drive end, it also a good place to conclude part one of this account. My family and I would move to Hilton Head Island, South Carolina in 1977, when I was ten years old. Part two will compile my continuing childhood paranormal experiences after the move. I really look forward to hearing the opinions of the YGS community concerning these events. It will be interesting to find out if others have experienced anything similar or have thoughts on what might have been happening that I haven't considered.

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The following comments are submitted by users of this site and are not official positions by yourghoststories.com. Please read our guidelines and the previous posts before posting. The author, Manafon1, has the following expectation about your feedback: I will read the comments and participate in the discussion.

Jubeele (4 stories) (228 posts)
 
1 week ago (2017-11-11)
I hear Simon & Garfunkel: <pitched at contralto range> "Like a Bridge over Troubled Water..."

This brings back my days with an "a cappella" singing group. I remember how hard it was to learn the Beatles song, "Because" from the "Love" album. All those weird half-tones! πŸ™„
Manafon1 (5 stories) (490 posts)
 
1 week ago (2017-11-11)
HaaHaa Jubeele - I'm a sixties baby myself. The hippy in me may be young but I'm a bit older πŸ€”. With a Coca-Cola in hand (per your song which is now lodged along with that commercial in my brain) I feel a Paul McCartney tune coming on, "Hands across the water... Hands across the sky".
Jubeele (4 stories) (228 posts)
 
1 week ago (2017-11-11)
Oh no, Manafon, I feel a song coming on: "I like to teach the world to sing, in perfect harmony..."

'Fraid so, I'm a 60's baby! 😘
Manafon1 (5 stories) (490 posts)
 
1 week ago (2017-11-11)
Jubeele and Cups - Thanks for your nice comments. You are right Jubeele, if only people could carry an unbiased logic with them, not only concerning the paranormal but with different viewpoints informed by cultural and ethnic diversity, the world would be a much nicer place in which to exist. The young hippy in me seems to be directing my hands as I type this πŸ˜‰.
Jubeele (4 stories) (228 posts)
 
1 week ago (2017-11-11)
Hello Manafon, many thanks for sharing this fascinating account.

I was struck by the lovely simplicity of your acceptance as a child with regards to your experiences. You didn't feel threatened; hence there was no cause for alarm. If only we could hold on to that unbiased logic, then there would be less unreasoning fear of the unknown and more openness to new ideas and different viewpoints. It would certainly make for a more peaceful, enriched world.

It was great that you connected with your bio-mom. I was really taken by the idea that your "beddy-bye" rocker could have been your grandmother. It's such a comfort to know that love could transcend time, distance and other boundaries.

I'll be certainly watching out for Part 2. 😊
Cups (2 stories) (20 posts)
+1
2 weeks ago (2017-11-06)
Manafon - I am just getting around to reading this one... What a cool story! The nightly arguing is interesting, especially the possibility of it being a residual imprint of a living person. The theory of your rocking ghost & the woman turning out the light is very sweet & touching. Thank you for sharing - I look forward to reading the rest of your catalog!:)
Manafon1 (5 stories) (490 posts)
+1
11 months ago (2016-12-25)
You aren't kidding about musicians dropping like flies this year Argette! Just heard on the news that George Michael has died. Greg Lake just died earlier this month. Can't remember another year when such a staggering number of musicians have passed away with such regularity. Prince, David Bowie, Keith Emerson, Glenn Frey, Leon Russell, Leonard Cohen, John Barry (of The Beastie Boys), Frank Sinatra Jr... And literally on and on.

Here's to hoping 2017 backs off on the culling of musicians.
Argette (guest)
+1
11 months ago (2016-12-25)
Thank you, Manafon. I was also disappointed in the article, but I know I read about the conversation somewhere else.

Either that or I had a deja but while I read the article.

With musicians dropping like flies this year, I would not be surprised it one of the parties isn't gone by now.

Sheesh. This year can't end fast enough!

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!
Manafon1 (5 stories) (490 posts)
 
11 months ago (2016-12-25)
Thanks Argette--I actually found the article you left the link for after you initially brought it up. It's really too bad the guy writing the article states point blank that he doesn't believe in ghosts and does not direct any follow up questions to Carly Simon.

It would have been interesting to know if the voices were of people who are deceased or still living... Or a combo. Oh yeah, don't worry about getting my silly user name incorrect. Either way works for me 😜. Happy Holidays and New Year Argette and all the rest of the great YGS community!
Argette (guest)
 
11 months ago (2016-12-25)
I mean, Manafon. I am so sorry!

Darn iPad keyboard.:) I swear it's haunted!
Argette (guest)
+1
11 months ago (2016-12-25)
AugustaM (2 stories) (398 posts)
+1
11 months ago (2016-12-21)
One of the most wonderful things about is site is finding experiences related by perfect strangers that renew your credulity in what you have experienced:)

I know my grandparents are out there keeping a weather eye out;) Maybe, one day they'll choose to show themselves in a more visual way - who knows:-)

Aye, Tweed - I was the wee one with the penchant for falling out of my ridiculously high bed and the music box;) I find myself doing the same as you when I read stories, I'll sense a similrity with something else I've read and, more often than I'd like to admit, my memory just can't grasp the strings tightly enough to draw them together lol
Kindly_refrain (12 stories) (149 posts)
+2
11 months ago (2016-12-20)
Manafon1, Tweed, Elfstone810, and all.

While pyschical researchers were investigating these phenomenon under tough peer pressure many years ago, there were also many people that embraced the ghostly from unlikely circles. In Canada at least, around the turn of the previous century, many spiritualists were protestant ministers (and frequently their wives) heading up spiritual groups and holding sΓ©ances etc. This, at the time, was not seen to be at odds with Christian faith. Recently, however, I see an increased polarization.

In the fundamental Christian camp any mention of ghostly phenomenon is considered at best unsavory and at worst downright evil.

Surprisingly vicious reactions can also be expected from those who feel they are too "scientific" to consider such nonsense. This to me is very odd as you would expect that science minded people would be the most interested in this enormously under studied phenomenon, reported by thousands. Unfortunately they have their own script and dogma that they follow.

On the other hand we have, in groups like this one, an open willingness to listen to and consider opinions and ideas about these phenomenon and discuss them in polite and thoughtful ways. Thanks for that everyone.
Tweed (22 stories) (2036 posts)
+2
11 months ago (2016-12-20)
Not only how far they went with their theories but also how compelling the evidence is/was. πŸ˜‰ They had to have had bags of courage to make their findings and opinions public. The census you mentioned is interesting, or maybe not so interesting, in that generally speaking Brits are still far more closed minded than Americans about anything paranormal. Stiff upper lip and all that. Some of that fear or need to follow the flock still lingers today.
I don't know if you've ever heard of Richard Dawkins, he's a smart guy and he means well, but he's an 'angry atheist'. You know, the kind who hates anything either religious or ghostly with a vengeance. A couple of years ago Russell Brand called him out for being essentially a wet blanket and foolish for denying the spiritual evidence surrounding us. That got me thinking along the lines of yeah if Dawkins hates religion and ghosts and stuff, why can't he just think of something else. Problem solved.
This is just one small example of a modern day spiritual disagreement but it's quite telling, I think, how firm the grip of fear still is. Both on an individual like Dawkins and the general public. Sometimes I wonder if it's no longer fear based ideology but more out of a historically passed down habit, following an accepted reality.

AugustaM, that was you! Ahh I remember your experience, that was amazing! Yeah, you and Manafon were around the same age, that's very cool. Hah, about a month ago I was trying to remember who it was on here with the music box who fell out of bed! πŸ˜†
Manafon1 (5 stories) (490 posts)
+2
11 months ago (2016-12-20)
AugustaM--Thanks so much for sharing your very similar experience with mysterious arguing voices. Our ages were very close when we experienced the voices and it does seem that played into their clarity and duration.

I wouldn't dwell too much on what might have happened had you not cried when you were older and your music box began playing. I have a feeling the spirit of your grandmother understood your reaction. Who knows, maybe one day she will check in on you again 😊.
AugustaM (2 stories) (398 posts)
+2
11 months ago (2016-12-20)
I had a similar experience to yours with the arguing voices when I was about the same age - my grand parents passed away within four months of each other in the house I grew up in. I was about four at the time and for the next few years, every night after everyone (my mother included) had gone to bed, I could hear them downstairs in the kitchen talking and putting away the dishes and silver wear... I never made much effort to understand what they were saying nor was I really frightened by it - it just was. That same grandmother came round again much like your silhouette lady who turned off the lamp - I had awoken from a nightmare to see the jewelry box with the music box inside it open up on its own and begin to play... Just like she used to do... But I was older then and had learned about being afraid of such things... I started to cry - the music stopped right away and I never heard them down in the kitchen again. I think they stopped coming then because they didn't want to scare me but I still wonder what would have been had I been as brave as you were and not cried...
Manafon1 (5 stories) (490 posts)
 
11 months ago (2016-12-20)
I won't be to harsh on the early psychical researchers Tweed. It just seems that they either fell on the, "all ghosts inhabit physical space" side of the fence or the, "all ghosts are telepathic" one. It is true that many of these researchers were deeply concerned about religious and political implications and flak. Many church leaders found the subject one that should be left alone. A census carried out in the late 1800s found that most people (this was carried out in England) liked to simply think if they lived a good life they would go to heaven and live there for eternity. Most stated they didn't want to think of the subject beyond that.

Most of the early researchers were scientists, doctors, politicians and so on. They were entrenched firmly in the social milieu of their time. Many were also members of the Royal Society, which was then a place of dead serious scientific study and discussion (and still is I suppose!). Considering all that, it really is impressive how far some of the early psychical researchers went with their theories!
Tweed (22 stories) (2036 posts)
 
11 months ago (2016-12-20)
Manafon, ha I never thought of EVPs, yeah of course. That's a whole different kettle of fish.
I guess all those great researchers were from a time when their findings were largely influenced by the religious and/or political climates of their time. I wouldn't be too harsh on them, they all sound way ahead of their time regardless. 😊
Tweed (22 stories) (2036 posts)
 
11 months ago (2016-12-20)
Also certain nocturnal animal eyes reflect as 'red' under night vision, I think it is. This is down to the structure of their eyes reflecting back. I think certain crocodiles reflect red while other animals reflect other colours. Perhaps the red eyed shadowpeeps have a similar structure or light principle going on.

I know ghosts can show up in mirrors, because I darn well had that happen in my rear view once. But this was a solid apparition. Just out of interest has anyone ever seen a shadow manifestation or shadow entity in a mirror?
Manafon1 (5 stories) (490 posts)
 
11 months ago (2016-12-20)
Tweed--I agree that there are varieties of apparitions. I think a vast number are telepathic in nature but absolutely not all of them. A frustrating aspect of many of the early psychical researches who put forward their various theories, is that very, very few ever address entities that can be photographed, filmed or recorded.

If we are to believe in genuine EVP's, for example (which I do), there is solid evidence that the voice is more than a telepathic message being sent from one consciousness to another. The same applies to legit paranormal forms caught on photos or moving about on film. That evidence suggests very compellingly that there is a variety of spirit that is literally occupying the physical space we humans do.

Tyrrell's theory is one I really dig but the fact that he simply ignores the massive evidence for types of spirits that fall outside the purely telepathic is incredibly frustrating. I will keep reading what I can find and if I ever find a more inclusive theory for all varieties of ghosts, I will definitely share it here on YGS! Either way ghosts are just going to be themselves and keep on doing those crazy things they do 😁
Tweed (22 stories) (2036 posts)
+2
11 months ago (2016-12-20)
Hey guys, fascinating discussion here, as always!

Like Kindly, I have a habit of looking for a unified theory, I often draw comparisons to other encounters here, there and everywhere, in some vain attempt to make sense of it all.

I've come to believe the apparitional drama (still love that pompous term! πŸ˜†) makes a lot of sense and does explain a lot of ghost encounters. However, I believe there are, or can be, other variants at work in other apparition cases.
For example the dancer woman I saw as a child felt like the telepathic apparitional drama variety, she was a complete person on the couch. But only where I looked. I saw her legs first then followed them up to her face, as this happened the rest of her kind of faded out.
By far the most confronting ghostie moment I've ever had, or am ever likely to have ever again (!), was when I ran into a solid ghost. For a couple of seconds the ghost was 'there' in the 'you wouldn't know it was a ghost' kind of way. Plus I felt the fabric of the clothes. The biggest question mark for me about this was that it felt totally accidental. Both ghost and I didn't know either was there until impact. So from that point of view there was no attempt at sending any apparitional drama. Plus why the heck was the ghost solid in the first place? There was interaction with a curtain, maybe that was it. But then loads of objects get interacted with without a solid manifestation. I don't get it.

Shadow people in my opinion fall into multiple categories.

Red eyed what the heckness, an entity in and of itself, in my opinion.

Hat dudes, another entity again, or maybe the same as the first, who knows.

People/animal shadow figures, as in Manafon's ghostie in this encounter. I believe Manafon's ghostie here is a straight up human ghost. The dark shadow forms of humans and animals I think are different levels of manifestation. This could be influenced by all kinds of things from the environment, light sources, anything. Why they appear super black I imagine is down to 'ghost matter'. Who knows what ghost matter is? I sure don't. But I bet that, like physical matter, there's got to be ghost matter, or thought matter. Like super tiny particles which are so small they can't catch or reflect light. I don't know, but I think it's particle related somewhere down the line of different levels of manifestation.

The red eyed dudes and the dudes with hats, however, seem to embody this dark shadow matter, consistently and almost exclusively. Because no one ever encounters them looking any other way.
elfstone810 (227 posts)
+1
11 months ago (2016-12-20)
Kindly_refrain, I do like your theory about shadow people absorbing energy. It fits in well with so many of the things we observe with regard to, not only shadow people but other types of phenomenon as well. There are just those few, niggling little areas where it doesn't work.

The same is true of Manafon's telepathy theory. Possibly there are different types of shadow people and different rules apply? Or perhaps the answer is some combination of the two theories.
Manafon1 (5 stories) (490 posts)
+2
11 months ago (2016-12-19)
Hi kindly refrain--Man, you bring up some of those frustrating gaps in any available "unifying" theory of apparitions. Your comment that even when apparitions appear "incomplete" or "imperfect" that manifestations occur along similar lines was a really perceptive one. My only tentative theory would be that the message being sent and received is done so thinking of the human body in its classic, archetypal form.

I think quite often, the most pertinent aspects of the human form are what the sender and reciever (as I WAY oversimplify Tyrrell's theory) collectively focus on. Hence seeing a full head and torso instead of a head and torso split down the center. The importance of transmitting essential bits of information, even if imperfect, I think favors an archetypal logic, of say a head and shoulders as opposed to half a head and one shoulder.

By the way, I do really dig the hypothesis you put forward of shadow figures absorbing light. It really reminds me of what I witnessed. In my last response I was trying to fit the "shadow person" theory into my ideas of apparitions but maybe I am oversimplifying things. At the end of the day, in paranormal matters, it's always best to err on the side of caution. Because let's face it, we're investigating what most people consider complete fantasy.

Your comments about the archetypal versions of what are referred to as shadow people has really piqued my interest. That your mother and daughter saw the same figure years apart is fascinating. I would argue that the archetypes that are reported as specific to shadow people could also be common to other reported apparitions. Many reports of recurring apparitions (in collected case studies) show that, if for instance, they have a hat, they will always appear with it no matter who happens to see them.

Apparitions used to be commonly referred to as shades and shadows, so when people refer to paranormal figures as shadow people because they have no discernible features it doesn't suggest to me they are something separate. Now they red eye thing... Well I don't know! Great thoughts and conversation Kindly refrain.
Kindly_refrain (12 stories) (149 posts)
+3
11 months ago (2016-12-19)
Hello Manafon1, I like some of the ideas you recount from Tyrrell. The idea that we, as perceivers, play a large role in how the manifestation will appear helps to account for the varied forms apparitions take on. It provides something I desire and that is a "unification theory" of apparitions.

The problem I have in fully accepting this view is that even in incomplete or imperfect manifestations they seem to be imperfect along very similar lines. Common incomplete manifestations include: no face, no eyes, upper or lower half of a torso only, and others. No matter if the receiver or the sender is responsible for the apparition why do they mostly seem to follow regular types of "errors"? There do not seem to be many reports of half a face, or one eye or a body split lengthwise instead of at the waist.

When we get to shadow people reports there seem to be archetypal versions. The plain shadow of a person type, the hat wearing type and the red eyed type (there may be others). Why should an imperfect shadow apparition so frequently be imperfect in the same way?

Neither my daughter nor my mother had ever heard of shadow people but they both saw one at my mother's house, years apart, without communicating the sighting to each other. The shadow person looked the same to both. This was the plain, looked like a shadow of a living person, version.

A security guard I spoke to recently told me of seeing a shadow of her uncle after he passed, when she was a child. I asked casually if it was wearing a large hat and she was shocked. She asked me how I knew and I told her that it was a frequently reported type of shadow person. She said then that because her uncle wore a hat they assumed it was him but that the shadow hat was larger than the hat he wore in life.

My hypothesis of energy absorption of course does not stand up fully either and certainly Elfstone's point that there should have been a vacant spot in the reflection in the mirror is certainly one problem with it. I could go out on a limb and say it was a one sided entity but I don't think that works either and I am not here trying to defend my hypothesis just laying it out for consideration.

The eye of the beholder idea that you espouse (sorry for the oversimplification) does have merits of course and does help describe why I saw different shoes than Doug did in my "Eldon House Shoes" account.

Again, I sure would like to have a unification theory for apparitions. Tyrrell's comes close but to me does not explain some of the aforementioned.
Manafon1 (5 stories) (490 posts)
 
11 months ago (2016-12-19)
Hi elfstone--Different posters have suggested various possible theories on what often reported dark entities, or shadow people, could be. Kindly refrain suggests the possibility of an entity that absorbs light and the apparition I saw as a child did almost seem to be doing just that.

However, in the case of babygoatpuller's shadow figure that cast no reflection, I suggested the alternative possibility that it is just another way an apparition may appear at times. If, as I believe, most apparitions are telepathic in nature, they will sometimes appear solid, at other times vague and indistinct and so on. The complexity of the apparition will depend on the complexity of the telepathic message that is sent to the person perceiving the "ghost". The subconscious of the person perceiving the apparition also contributes to the resulting apparition. This cooperative relationship between the "theme" sent by the thought of a deceased or living person interacts with subconscious constituents of the living person receiving the telepathic transmission. Collectively this creates what is commonly referred to as an "apparitional drama".

By this course of reason, if the message being sent is vague, or incomplete, for instance, the apparition may appear as an entity without a face or, as in a shadow figure, as something that appears as a black cutout. What you suggest of a resulting "shadow person shaped hole" in babygoatpuller's mirror is why I believe that shadow people are quite possibly just another variation on "old school" apparitions as opposed to entities that are literally absorbing the light around them.

Of course it's all theoretical and every theory offers much to consider! I will have to look up, that Hinton Ampner case you reference.
elfstone810 (227 posts)
+3
11 months ago (2016-12-19)
Fascinating account! Can't wait to hear the rest.

Your possibly residual argument reminds me of the classic haunting at Hinton Ampner in (I believe) the 1700s.

I will admit I'm having trouble following the science of the shadow person, especially as is related to not having a reflection. If the shadow person basically absorbs all light that touches it, wouldn't there be a shadow person shaped "hole" in the image reflected in the mirror where it blocked the light from objects behind it?

Love this discussion!
Manafon1 (5 stories) (490 posts)
+1
11 months ago (2016-12-19)
Tweed--Your thought about why BGP's shadow figure didn't cast a reflection is great stuff. Kindly refrain also put forth some interesting ideas. As I wrote in my response to Kindly refrain, it seems also possible, if these shadow figures are in any way telepathically sent and then received by an "agent" and "percipient", it could also be a possibility that the sent message is sometimes more complete, or complex, than at other times.

If this is sometimes the case, it could be that a shadow not being cast could be part of the theory I mentioned to kindly. Specifically, that no apparitions are ever "perfect" and at least one feature or element seems to be "off". So on one occasion an apparition may not cast a reflection in a mirror, in another instance an apparition may not have facial features, on still another occasion it may be semi-transparent. There are many intriguing theories floating around!
Tweed (22 stories) (2036 posts)
+2
11 months ago (2016-12-19)
Hey Manafon and everyone,

I've been away from YGS for a few days, so this is a bit delayed. It's about the nature of shadow like manifestations. BGP said her shadow figure didn't show up in her mirrored wall as you might expect it to. When we look into a mirror what we see isn't so much a reflection, rather a 'print' of light. This probably explains why hers didn't show up in the mirror and further fuels speculation around these types of manifestations appearing as if to absorb light.
Manafon1 (5 stories) (490 posts)
+1
11 months ago (2016-12-18)
Kindly refrain--I like your thoughts about what many people refer to as "shadow people". I checked out that link on Vantablack. In case others are interested, "Vantablack is a super black coating that holds the world record as the darkest man made substance." Furthermore, "Vantablack absorbs virtually all incident light... It reflects so little light that it is often described as the closest thing to a black hole we'll ever see."

Although the figure I saw was intensely dark and did indeed seem to absorb all light around it, my young mind thought of the form as three dimensional even though it appeared something like a two dimensional cutout. I perceived it distinctly as a female form and what made me think of it as three dimensional, was that as it moved, it's outline changed as a three dimensional body would. The head moved slightly and seemed to turn, just a bit, which changed very subtley the shape. I also noticed this with the arm switching out the light.

I did want to clarify though that I am not a person that feels comfortable categorizing what many refer to as "shadow people" as a completely separate phenomenon from other types of apparition. Apparitions are perceived in various forms of "completeness". As many psychical researchers have written (notably G.N.M. Tyrrell) there never seems to be a "perfect apparition". So some people will see a partial apparition, maybe from only the torso up, others an apparition with no discernible features, another may see a whole apparition that seems to want to speak but is unable to and so on.

Following this line of reasoning I see no reason to not think an apparition would on occasion appear as a perfectly formed outline with blackness comprising the shape. This could very well have much to do with how a living person receives a telepathic message from an "agent", either living or dead. This would mean that in some cases the sent message and the mind of the recipient could be particularly harmonious, thus creating a clear, lifelike figure. In another instance a message received might be more vague and so features, as an example, are absent. At any rate, it's thoroughly fascinating stuff to ponder kindly refrain!
Kindly_refrain (12 stories) (149 posts)
+4
11 months ago (2016-12-18)
The two dimensional aspect of "Shadow Figures" was always a little troubling to me. I understand little of ghostly phenomenon but I frequently wondered why do these "ghosts" appear to be two dimensional. I believe I may have an answer from the world of industrial coatings.

Many people who experience ghostly phenomenon claim to be feel cold, see electrical lights flicker or have batteries run out extremely quickly or indeed feel drained themselves. It seems energy of all types are absorbed in the manifestation process.

I believe that in absorbing energy they give off very little themselves, hence the blackness.

Our eyes process differing shades of light bouncing off of surfaces, at different angles from an object, to determine its three dimensional form. If there is no variation in shade we determine that the object is flat. If no light at all bounces off of the object, however three dimensional it may be, we make the same determination; the object is flat.

In this case we are fooled.

This has recently been achieved with very black coatings. Using Nano-technology materials have been made to reflect less than 1 percent of the light that strikes it. To the observer this makes the object look two dimensional.

While this does not answer all aspects of shadow people sightings, I do believe it answers the two dimensional appearance of three dimensional manifestations. The blackness then is not to be thought of as sinister but merely a "physical" quality of these types of manifestations. We are, in essence, watching a form of energy black hole.

Here is a link to a commercialized version of the ultra black coating science I was referring to earlier.

Https://www.surreynanosystems.com/media/news

You will have to search in the link a little as this web site would not let me put in the full length link (word too long).

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