Darker Than The Darkest!

I just re-read my last post. I came out sounding negative and I did not mean my statement to be that way. I do subscribe to Archaeology Mag. And read every detail with interest.

We all share many things in common. We are readers, writers, Parents, Daughters and Sons. Workers, homeowners, kind, gifted, and so much more. I could fill pages with things we have in common.

Some of us share a love for music, and when you think of it, Don"t worry, be Happy is a very catchy tune. It remains a shame that all, World Wide, can not live by that those short words. It would be a more joyful World.

Thank you Rex-T and Biblio,

My best,
Jan

Well Folks,

A lifelong love of Archaeology, causes me to search out the digs at various places in the world. Oftentimes a musical item is placed in a grave of the player.
In the first Millennium BC a bronze bell was found buried next to owner. It is believed it was carried by warriors as they were loud and carried a message of fear.

Then there was the drum in the revolutionary...

I guess not all musical items are joyous.

Jan

Hi Jan,

I'll put in my "two bob's worth" (20 cents), for what it's worth.

I would sing my favorite songs out loud, alone in the car while driving to and from work, in peak hour traffic. No road rage in my car!

When I was at a low point in my life (taking medication to treat my failing liver), a counselor and good friend made the observation that one could not possibly feel positive if he/she wasn't happy. He advised me to go to a place where I could relax and hum a Bobby McFerrin song called "Don't Worry Be Happy". I still find myself unconsciously mind singing this song, from time to time.

My point being, that I certainly agree with Biblio. Music has the power to pull you back from the brink to a secure place.

Rex-T

What a lovely effort they made to comfort you and make you feel secure in your departure! Wow! 😊

As for your dad's opinion, "My Father told me I would be smarter if I hadn't filled my brain with the words of songs," I'll quote Colonel Sherman T. Potter of the 4077: "Horse hockey!" Songs are poems and meter & rhyme and empathy and patriotism and love and hope. They're one of the few things *worth* filling your head with.

-Biblio.

P.S.: "It's going to be a bright, bright, bright sunshiny day." --Johnny Nash.

Jubeele and Biblio,

The voices I joined with during that dark time, were the couple that taught me voice, from the age of twelve to seventeen. We often would just break into a song during choir practice.

Bill and June were killed in a horrible car accident in 1982. I was beyond devastation. The other driver that ran them off the road and down a rocky embankment, never stopped. Others were unable to remember details, other than it was a black car.

I had spent holidays with that wonderful couple, they had no children and were very kind to me. My Dad would join at times, he shared my sadness. I loved that couple and often called them Aunt and Uncle.

As the experience fades from the foreground, I remain confidend that they helped me reach the light of day.

Biblio, after your last post I have been thinking of all the songs that have the word day, sun, moon, evening, light, morning and so forth. There are so many! My Father told me I would be smarter if I hadn't filled my brain with the words of songs.

Yes, that couple came to the darkest, to help me leave.

Jan

Biblio - Harry Belafonte's rendition of "Banana Boat" is one of my favourite feel-good songs. I'll gladly join in the chorus with you in my controlalto. But beware, there was a music critic in the place, Mr. Grump who told Jan: "Hey shut it will ya". 😜

Jan - I wonder if our departed loved ones become part of the angelic choir. 😲 "I knew both of the other voices I sang with during this experience, yet they had been dead for years." It is a wonderful experience to have sung in harmony with voices from beyond the Veil. Your strength and grace continues to be an inspiration. 😘

"Day-o, day-o...
Daylight come and me wan' go home"
--Harry Belafonte

I'm a bass, so it's a challenge for me to hit the higher notes. However, if any YGSers hear the "Banana Boat Song" in that limbo between this world and the next, you'll know there's only one person who is *that* insanely optimistic.

-Biblio.

Thank you, Biblio, Jan is going strong!

I agree with what you have written, and you put all the words together, so much better than I could have.

If anyone finds themselves in the Darker than the Darkest, Sing! Sing! Sing! 😊

Take care Biblio,
Jan

Thank you SWS,

Every day is a good day! Having more chemo was disappointing, but they have taken away some of the drugs. (modified) It is easier to handle.

All these notes, mean so much.
😊 ❤
Jan

Hi Lady-glow

Thank you so much for your kind, well wishes, you are a sweetheart.

❤ ❤ 😊

Jan

Hi, Jan.

The best tool in cancer treatments is a positive attitude about your successes. (My cousin, the BBC cameraman, is going through chemo, too.)

The Hell reference in my previous post, which I do not think I made clear enough, was to bolster your spirits after your exchange with RC on November 4th: "Good heavens, RC you can't mean I was in H---. Oh! Now I am scared!" I did not address that directly, which --in retrospect-- would have made more sense. I'll agree with you, comparatively, that it was "lucky me" skimming over the top of the liquid darkness whereas you found yourself within it; I'll just add that I was terrified of what would happen to me *if* I were to fall into it! Your experience, though alarming, will provide me with a plan of action if I ever find myself in a similar situation. For this, I sincerely thank you.

I've been pondering what you wrote, "the fact that my heart did stop three different times during surgery. Is it not possible that I was closer to a realm of death, due to that happening just hours before." Absolutely. I agree with your analysis here, in that the physical proximity to death would have been a trigger for your consciousness to separate from your body in a very natural manner. (I do know a biology & chemistry teacher who watched most of her operation while floating near the ceiling of her surgery; they'd had to re-start her heart once, but it was at that point she was able to watch the rest of the surgery from nearby.) You are fortunate that the medically-induced coma (clearly an effort to relieve the strain on your body) *was* a deliberate choice by your medical team; you'd have round-the-clock supervision, close monitoring, etc. Having already had the impetus to separate from the physical --despite your not being prepared to let go-- your soul may have indeed wandered about in the afterlife, if only out of curiosity about what happens next.

"The hardest part was sitting in a hospital, thinking about it, and knowing I could not talk to anyone." That's a horrible, isolating feeling, isn't it? Understanding that you've endured an ordeal, undergone a psychic/spiritual shock or traumatic event, and realizing that you can't even share it with the medical team for fear they'll drug you up while you're vulnerable, exposing you to God knows what further experiences. You're stuck there in a bed, having to act like everything's ok, reassuring your family and friends, and sounding chipper to everyone, while inside you're screaming "What was that? Why did it happen to me? Who'll understand this and not think I need to have prescription drugs and theraputic counseling?" The existential anguish of knowing *exactly* what you know, and having no-one who'll listen to your statements in a reasonable, objective, and understanding manner.

On balance, I think you did the right thing, not mentioning it to the hospital staff; some staff --usually nurses, I find-- will listen with a level of belief because of odd events they've experienced in their work, but you can't always separate out the gossips from the compassionate listeners when you're the one recuperating. Writing it all out for yourself must have been a HUGE relief!

Good to know you're still going strong, Jan.

Take care,
Biblio.

Hello MsForgetMeNott,

I'm sorry to hear you have to start treatment all over again.

You have so much support here on YGS. After reading all the lovely comments from YGS members, I know you will be willed better. Everyone wants the best for you and wants you to recover soon.

Take care and keep all of us posted.

Best wishes,
Miandra
😘 ❤ 😘

Jan - it's so good to 'see' you around. I really enjoyed reading your experience and the thread of comments.

Sending your way a ton of good vibes and a big hug.

Just thinking about the 'chemo' word gives me goosebumps... Stay strong. ❤

Jan,

I'm glad you are open to my idea that you might have experienced an OBE. Some may find it strange, but in my opinion, it's experienced by many people. If you ever want to chat about this, my email is on my profile. 😊

Dee ❤

PS: Melda, it does sound like you were experiencing an OBE. It sounds quite interesting. Likewise, if you are interested, you know you can send me an email. 😉

Jan - You've had so much feedback on your experience that there isn't much left for me to say.

I can only tell you about what I experienced during a coma, coming out of the coma - I'm not sure which it was. Mine was not an induced coma, I had a back op and my lungs collapsed. I won't go into too much detail but I can tell you that those days were the worst of my life. I went into hospital expecting to be out within a week and ended up staying a month. If I spoke to you personally, or possibly via email, I could tell you some of the things that I "saw" during that time.

The only experience that I know was real was when I found myself in my kitchen (while I was in the coma, or coming out of it) watching my son making a sandwich and everything was in a light orange haze. I tried to attract his attention but couldn't. I'm convinced that that actually happened, my spirit going on a little journey. Definitely not a NDE.

I discussed this with the physician who treated me and he told me that what I experienced was due to hypoxia (lack of oxygen to the brain) combined with the meds I was given. I believe him for the most part but not the episode with my son.

Who knows what you experienced? I don't believe that everything is black and white, there are grey areas in between.

I wish you the strength to cope with the treatment which you have to undergo. I know chemo is extremely unpleasant. I have seen members of my family undergoing this. You have a lot of friends on this site although you don't know us personally ❤

Regards, Melda

Hi Rex-T

Boy we have a big circle from OB to drug cocktail. Who can say!

😊 I could go for a cocktail 🙄

Have a good night.

Jan

Hi Jubeele,

It would seem I had not mastered how to move in the liquid darkness, and to be funny I began to blast out twist and shout. I was having fun but Mr. Grump, was not into the 60s music. We can't all be smiles.

OBE is a possible theory, but who can say now, unless it happens again. 😊

Jan

RC,

I did write it down when I got home. Things happened during that time I would not repeat on YGSs. So crazy, even as I typed it, I knew I would never tell all.

My Birthday is in May also, it would be funny if we shared the same date!

😊 Jan

Hi Dee ❤,

The possibility of an OBE experience was in my thoughts. So little is known about them, and they seem to be individual to the person. It too, is a good theory.

Thank you for your kind thoughts, I am having chemotherapy tomorrow, kidney infection or not. Got to fight the fight!

Smiles and happiness to you,

Jan

Hi Anno Domini,

Your ideas take what's happened in a different dirrection. I would like to think that the power of the drugs were to cause of the whole event.

Perhaps there should have been less or more of that drug cocktail. I think your's is a good theory.

Thank you for your thoughts,

Jan

Hi Biblio,

I have seen in previous conversations that you and my Son went back and forth for a bit. I was very pleased that Brian continued to convey messages to those that were interested.

Biblio, you are so right fluid darkness, and after a while, while in that level, you begin to make movements that are much like swimming. Lucky you to be skimming over. You were in control, but I was not. I was not there willingly, but I have always loved singing, it has helped me, as when I sing, I am happy.

I never said it was hell, I said is this death? It was interesting when you mentioned Swedenborge's travels, as at some point in my computer travels I had read about his heavy beliefs.

I would like to bring up, the fact that my heart did stop three different times during surgery. Is it not possible that I was closer to a realm of death, do to that happening just hours before.
Just trying to find some common sense, in the confusion.
Meaning perhaps as the drugs given to place me into a coma, were administrated a bit to soon, for a person who's heart had to be jump started only a few hours before.

I did write what I recalled of that time, only days after home. The hardest part was sitting in a hospital, thinking about it, and knowing I could not talk to anyone.

Thank you for your insight,

Jan

Lucia, I think you're right about the saint's name. Not sure about the other part, though. 😊 The Orthodox Christian church, which is what I practice and sometimes get right, does not have a concept of Purgatory.

Regardless, disturbing to talk with a skull. 😁

Glad you're back with us, Jan.

Hi Jan, I'd like to think it was just a dream. But obviously, I don't know what you experienced.

In your dream state you could have heard other voices of those visiting you in the hospital or the nurses etc... And interpreted it in your brain as such to make sense to you.

I'd also like to think it was all a dream as well because my father spent the last year of his life in a coma.

RC, the saint you speak of is Macarius. The story I know of him is slightly different. It refers more to purgatory rather than hell. In the story: The spirits there get no relief from the darkness unless you pray for them, that is what connects them to others.

Regardless, I personally don't believe you were in purgatory or hell but a state of unconscious dream.

Although, I might change my opinion if I'm provided with all of the details. No matter how strange we all would love to hear even if it sounds crazy.

Greetings, Jan!

It is good to know you are improving. As I told Brian during his regular updates, I saw you talking to both the living and the dead equally, and drawing strength from those conversations, during your recovery. I honestly think that you needed to be there to begin your healing process.

I saw the fluid darkness from above, once. I could see a golden outline highlighting the choppy waves, like Quabbin Reservoir on a breezy day, but there was no light source in the black sky. I felt fortunate to be skimming above the "water," as I was aware of being away from myself, but I needed to move above the surface to an island (?) a shore (?) a stationary point, where I had to see a beyond-crystal-clear image (razor sharp details with 100% focus). I was shown the picture (more like a slice of time) by an elusive figure who made grand arm gestures with his monk-like robes that fade into dark grays and shadows if I try to remember him.

I do not think that you were in hell. Your description reminded me of the River Lethe (forgetfulness), Carl Jung's "collective unconscious," and of Emanuel Swedenborg's trips to the afterlife. If you can tolerate his Fundamentalist Lutheran bias, Swedenborg's journals and theories may be of some use to you. Swedenborg asserted that there was an afterlife that started in a neutral territory, and that souls would gravitate toward similar souls. "Swedenborg calls the realm we enter immediately after death the world of spirits, an intermediate realm situated between heaven and hell. It can be thought of as a 'sorting out' zone from which spirits go to either heaven or hell. He describes three states that people might pass through in this realm...It's important to note that all human beings arrive in the spiritual world as equals. Regardless of their religious background or their personal beliefs, regardless of their nationality, gender, or race, all people have an equal chance to go to either heaven or hell. That decision is made by the individuals themselves, in the form of every choice they've made to act in either a loving way or a selfish way" (https://swedenborg.com/emanuel-swedenborg/explore/spiritual-world/).

If you had been visiting hell, or even a purgatory, you'd have experienced dread, panic, terror, and your rational mind would have been overwhelmed with agonized confusion. You were able to determine a level of self-control & movement within the situation. That atmosphere may not have been the pleasant or reassuring, but I don't think that souls in a state of damnation could sing "Amazing Grace" with conviction, let alone enjoy "The Sound of Music."

I agree with everyone who suggested trying to write out what you remember before these ephemeral experiences slip from your memory. They don't have to be shared with the rest of us, but it may do you some good to look over them in comparison to Swedenborg's writings.

Stay strong, Jan.

Best,
Biblio.

Hello to all,

Having a busy day here so for now I will answer to all. I did, the first day I could get to my computer I did write it in full. It was so unbelievable, how could I expect others to find it factual. That was why I could not get it to a point where it might be published. Yes, there is much more, perhaps as I get stronger, I can share more.

My Mother died of breast cancer before I reached 10. She set up some rules for my Dad. I was to get piano lessons, and voice lessons, and I did. I knew both of the other voices I sang with during this experience, yet they had been dead for years.

That is the mystery, how can the living haunt the dead?

I appreciate your interest,

Jan

Hi again Jan,

I second, or maybe third, RC and Jubeele's suggestion to record the full version of events, if for nobody else but yourself.

I know from experience that as time goes by after an extraordinary event, the mind plays tricks with one's recollection in three ways. Critical details and memories can "fade away", be altered or added.

For example, I witnessed a burglary where the perpetrator escaped in a car. The court case dragged on for years and fortunately the detective invited me to review what I had seen before the next sitting. Every time I told him about the car, he would smile and ask me if I was sure. In the end, he showed me a picture of the car and I read my statement again. I was stunned. After six years my recollection had changed the color of the car!

You now have your statement on YGS, but you may or may not want to make the fine details public. Everybody is different, the same as every situation is unique. I suppose having your complete experience could be handy when presented with a different perspective (as with Anno_Domini). This would allow you to consider broadening your view without compromising your beliefs.

Hope this makes sense Jan.

Rex-T

Jan, it's so good to hear from you. As RC has said, do write down your experience while it's fairly fresh in your memory. Or record it if that's easier for you.

The first impression that came to my mind was that you were joined by some otherworldly (angelic?) choir. Perhaps the chemical stimuli from all those drugs brought you to a heightened state where you could hear them. But because it wasn't yet your time, you couldn't fully see them - they were beyond the Veil. Just a thought. 🤔

How curious that the male voice told you to "shut it". Someone's always a critic. I wonder if he could also have been a fellow traveller, someone on his own OBE. Did you remember what you talked about?

'Amazing Grace' is one of my favourite hymns. Never fails to move me to tears. Perhaps those singers kept you company so that you wouldn't be alone in the dark.

Sending you loving thoughts for your continued recovery. ❤

Jan, I hope you were not! But reading this account, that is the first thing that came to my mind.

It is also interesting that you are "forgetting" events. Most people think of their memory as being something akin to a photo album. Reality is more complex. The state in which you were when the memory was formed affects recall as just one example. There is also what is called post-hoc interference; memories formed after the event can, and do, alter things.

Just as an example: I remember a great blizzard happening when I was 10 years old, with snowfalls, not drifts - the actual snowfall, being 10+ feet! Specifically, this blizzard: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blizzard_of_%2777

My birthday is in May, and I turned 10 in 1977, so I could not have been 10 when the blizzard struck. Splitting hairs, but fine details like this can matter at times.

The most likely reason you're having trouble recalling this experience is because it happened while you were in a drugged coma. As your body metabolizes and eliminates the medication, recall will become harder. If you can, try to write down as much as you can remember now? Please 😁

Hi msforgetmenott, I hope you are recovering well from your op. I am of the opinion this might have something to do with the medically induced coma, these drugs are meant to put a person in the same physiological state as being asleep, but through different chemical pathways, so who knows what happens in our heads during this period? I am sure that different people also react differently to stimuli and these drug cocktails during their rest.

Jan,

Thank you for getting back to me. I'm sorry to hear you have a kidney infection. Hopefully, it is resolved soon so you can move onto the chemo treatments.

I was curious about your movements being thought based because some of the details from your experience remind me of astral projection or an out of body experience (OBE). There are similarities that I found intriguing.

Thanks again for sharing. I'm sending you positive energy and hugs still ❤

Dee